Glad to read the headlines of the DR today. Maybe now everyone can stop all the BS and get back to basics.
Remember it's a building holding 5000 + people we're fighting against. Not race or religion. The whole scope is too big for our town regardless of who's going to be using the site. That is the subject at hand. All the rest is making our town look stupid.
WOW what a refreshing change! An article in the Daily Record with FACTS and newsworthy information!?? What happen..Hey Rob are you sure you ran this past your editor? LOL
Interestingly the PR firm is silent on this - yet it is the ONLY relevant topic they SHOULD be commenting on!
GO MARCI GO!!!!
Rockaway Twp. gears up for battle
By Rob Jennings, Daily Record
ROCKAWAY TWP. -- The township has hired a prominent attorney perhaps best known for her advocacy against the Religious Land Use and Institutionalized Persons Act (RLUIPA), the 4-year-old federal statute invoked in the Christ Church building plan controversy.
Marci Hamilton, who cemented her legal reputation in 1997 by winning a religious land use case before the U.S. Supreme Court, said Wednesday she had been retained by the law firm of planning board attorney William Dimin.
"She has been retained as a consultant," Mayor Louis Sceusi said Wednesday.
Sceusi, who serves on the planning board, said he expected Dimin's firm would bill the township for her services.
"We would consult with Marci Hamilton because the church has brought up RLUIPA allegations. She is the foremost authority on RLUIPA in the country," Sceusi said.
Dimin did not return a phone call Wednesday and terms of Hamilton's contract were not available.
At planning board public hearings, Christ Church's attorney, Wendy Berger, has cited RLUIPA in arguing that the planning board may not block the 5,000-member, Montclair-based evangelical Christian church simply because of its size. RLUIPA gives churches great leeway in zoning matters.
Christ Church spokesman Marc Weinstein declined comment Wednesday.
Hamilton, 46, of Bucks County, Pa., said in an e-mail that she will meet with township officials today but declined further comment. Hamilton had been informally advising the township for some time regarding the Christ Church building plan. She has represented a number of municipalities in RLUIPA cases.
Christ Church wants to build a 3,000-seat sanctuary, private K-5 school and other facilities at the 107-acre, former Agilent Technologies site on Green Pond Road. The proposal has generated widespread local opposition. A sixth planning board hearing will be held on May 19.
Lisa Salberg, co-founder of Voices of Rockaway Township, which opposes the building plan, said Hamilton's involvement was a justified response to the advocacy of the Washington, D.C.-based Becket Fund on behalf of Christ Church.
"Christ Church threw down the gauntlet when they threatened us with a lawsuit," said Salberg, referring to a Jan. 21 letter from the Becket Fund's senior legal counsel, Derek L. Gaubatz.
Gaubatz' letter was written after Dimin, at the first planning board hearing, asked the board to consider whether township officials had envisioned so-called "mega-churches" in adopting a zoning ordinance permitting churches as a conditional use.
Gaubatz charged that RLUIPA made no such distinction and cited a case in which planning board members were held personally liable for denying an application for religious assembly.
"The township is acting prudently in making sure we are prepared for any eventuality," Salberg said.
Becket Fund spokesman Pat Korten declined comment Wednesday. Previously, Korten said his organization will represent Christ Church if it ends up in court with the township, as many anticipate.
"I don't see the planning board and the township accepting the project the way it is," township resident Charles Mueller, who opposes the building plan, said Wednesday.
"Regardless of how it's turned down, I'm sure they're going to take the township to court. In that case, I think it's great they've got Marci on board," Mueller said.
Hamilton, a former law clerk to Supreme Court Justice Sandra Day O'Connor, has carved out a high-profile niche in battling religious institutions she sees as overstepping their bounds.
Hamilton has been involved in clergy sex abuse cases and argued, in her writings, that the phrase "Under God" should be removed from the Pledge of Allegiance.
In the 1990s, Hamilton represented the city of Boerne, Tex., which was sued by a local Catholic church after blocking its expansion proposal. That church claimed the city was in violation of the Religious Freedom Restoration Act of 1993.
Hamilton argued the law was unconstitutional under the 14th Amendment. The court agreed.
Three years later, Congress adopted RLUIPA in response. While not as far-reaching as its invalidated predecessor, RLUIPA has had the practical effect of greatly aiding churches in zoning disputes,
"It's a wonderful person to bring to the conversation," Salberg said of Hamilton. "We have the best expert we can possibly have and I'm glad that we do."
Meanwhile, as the planning board process moves forward on Christ Church, the K-8 school district is weighing whether to build a new school and the Agilent site is one of three possibilities under consideration.
School officials have said their interest in the site is unrelated to local objections to Christ Church.
Can you please stop the name calling. Is your life that bad that you need to make sure everyone else's life is terriable? Would you want us to think of a "special name" for you?
quote: Originally posted by: Kim Jenkins "Ted Can you please stop the name calling. Is your life that bad that you need to make sure everyone else's life is terriable? Would you want us to think of a "special name" for you? Find someother source of enterainment... Kim Jenkins"
Kim,
You jump on Ted for questioning Lisa & Lou's ethics?
Seems you and your group have had no problem publicly questioning David Irelands ethics from the beginning, have you?
Let me ring some bells for you in case your memory has blurred:
Daniel, you must have taken the same online test as Craig.
Another Genius!
LOL!
Sorry, acronym insults prove only that you're mental capacity is VERY limited.
And they also show that you have no response when it's revealed that your VORT leaders are very confused people, attacking the same tactics that they themselves have used repeatedly.
Please present YOUR proof of conspiricy...and I do not mean your spin on what your pea-brain gathers out of reading newspapers and online forums. Give us the concrete dirt and earn some respect for a change!
quote: Originally posted by: Ted Doty "So getting back to business, can any of you refute the connection between "Lying Lou" and "Lying Lisa"? Or did Lying Lou command that you attack me and hope it goes away?"
tED,
Getting back to business, can you refute the connetion between Rev. Ireland and tED dOTY? Did Mr. Ireland command you to attack VORT and hope it goes away?
quote: Originally posted by: Connections " tED, Getting back to business, can you refute the connetion between Rev. Ireland and tED dOTY? Did Mr. Ireland command you to attack VORT and hope it goes away? "
No, vORT's mistakes are so obvious that, as an honest citizen, I can't resist pointing them out.
Turd must be on the CC payroll else he is completely out of his mind. There must be some rationalle why anyone in this town wants to become Irelands benefactor. That is, if we are to assume that he is sane. I know, real bad assumption.
quote: Originally posted by: Ted Doty "No, vORT's mistakes are so obvious that, as an honest citizen, I can't resist pointing them out."
tED - I'll refrain from commenting on your 'honest citizen' remark. I'll leave that for people to form their own opinions.
You have not pointed out "VORT's mistakes". You have accused Lisa of being a liar who takes her orders from Mayor Sceusi, whom you also accuse of being a liar.
You have pointed out nothing. You have contributed nothing to the conversation.
quote: Originally posted by: honest citizen MA " tED - I'll refrain from commenting on your 'honest citizen' remark. I'll leave that for people to form their own opinions. You have not pointed out "VORT's mistakes". You have accused Lisa of being a liar who takes her orders from Mayor Sceusi, whom you also accuse of being a liar. You have pointed out nothing. You have contributed nothing to the conversation. "
The "Agilent time line" published a few months back proves Lou's Liess. Lisa' s Lies are proven by her misrepresentations of the church application as well as Ireland's statements
The two most recent vORT mistakes are Lying Lisa's failure to denounce Maier's comments and letting the cat out of the bag regarding Ms Hamilton.
quote: Originally posted by: C6H12HO6 "Where is Irelands denounciation of all the CC supporters and shills pertaining to their immoral behaviour on this venue? We are waiting."
This is and always was a vORT site. The only out of line comments have come from Lying Lisa and Maier.
Excuse me Ted, but no one let the cat out of the bag and it wasn't a secret. Marci herself a few months back let it be known that RT had spoken to her. We all knew she was being considered as an advisor and hoping that RT would hire her. There's no conspiracy. And don't try to make something out of nothing. We are all fine with her.
Sorry Ted. This has nothing to do with VORT. I have an email from March 2, from Marci herself saying that she is talking to RT about retaining her. If you search the boards, I wrote a post about this. No one is lying. I'm trying to be civil to you, but you are wearing me down. I will not be baited, but I must reply regarding the truth. The proof is here on the boards. Look before you make more of a fool of yourself.
quote: Originally posted by: Tellymark "Sorry Ted. This has nothing to do with VORT. I have an email from March 2, from Marci herself saying that she is talking to RT about retaining her. "
Yes, butyour published letter states that Hamilton has been retained; youyr email says they're just talking.
How did you know? I think the answer is obvious. Nice try though
I have no published letter on the board just the email that Marci sent back in March in which she says they are discussing her being retained. I will not defend myself again, nor will I let myself be baited by you as I would hope the rest of RT residents would refrain from doing.
This fight is about the amount of people and the magnitude of Christ Church. If you can't stick to the subject at hand, then don't bother to put your two cents in. I, for one, do not want to hear it. I have better things to think about-saving my town.
The letter was published in the Citizen and Daily Record. You stated that Hamilton has been retained. Your email only states Hamilton is talking to the town.
VORT knew before the 12th for certain that Marci had been retained. Their letter had to be submitted at least one day before publication. So they knew at least as early as the 11th. This is before that fact was made public in any other media account. So it is clear that VORT is kept informed by the town leaders of what is going on before the general public is let in on the news.
Since the Mayor is on the Planning Board, you'd expect that he at least maintain the appearence of being impartial iinstead of being so closely linked to VORT.
Do you have a life? You seem to spend an obscene amount of time calling people names and TRYING to make good people look bad. Please try and refrain from making a total @ss out of yourself and stop with the petty BS. You are going to think whatever you want and other people are going to think whatever they want. The POINT is that Christ Church is TOO BIG for Rockaway Twp. NOTHING else. End of discussion. Period.
Yet, we all know that you will have some comment about this post. You will also accuse me of being an attack dog for VORT. Well, I do not know the mayor or the Jenkins or the Salbergs. I do not know Dr. Ireland or his PR firm or his advisors or his attorney. I do KNOW that Christ Church is TOO BIG for Rockaway Twp. Let me say that again...
CHRIST CHURCH IS TOO BIG FOR ROCKAWAY TWP.
Now, IF you have any facts/data as to why you disagree with this statement. I'm all ears. Leave the personal attacks out. I don't care if you hate the mayor or the Jenkins or the Salbergs. Don't care if you hate Dr. Ireland. Don't care if you are a member of Christ Church. Don't care if you think that Christ Church is a cult. Your opinion of these people or anything, has NOTHING to do with the application at hand. NO ONE'S opinion has ANY effect on the outcome of this matter. The application will be approved or denied according to the FACTS! ALL laws will be followed. Make no mistake about that. So, please provide me with your FACTS/DATA as to why this application should be approved and what it will contribute to Rockaway Twp. Maybe I'm missing something. Please do not bring ANYONE into your response. There is no need for that. Can you make a valid point? Or do you just ramble and ramble and spew anger? I'll be willing to bet that you can NOT respond to this post without bring someone into it and name calling. Come on. Anyone want to take me up on that bet? 3 to 1 odds.