I have been quiet for the last year watching this board as things pass along in time, especially after I stated that I would no longer post here. I am breaking that promise tonight on the eve of 2005, but will regress to my previous posture hereafter.
Daniel, our dormer brought up some excellent points that have not been addressed by the room in the last year. But, worse than that, is watching the total tolerence of Irelands so called version of Christianity that we are seeing pop up here in our own township.
In short, if I were to be a Christian, and this man Ireland were to be pretending to be representing me and my beliefs, I would be totally embarassed and ashamed of myself and my religion. I would be expressing repugnance about it in those specific terms.
However, I do not see that occuring. I see a lot of PC thinking going on here. If you Christians can not stand up to this guy, then you all should be ashamed of yourselves and your beliefs, unless he is accurately representing your own personal thinking. If that is the case, - - - then - - - shame on you! That would mean that you are a religious bigot in my humble opinion. The following sentiment is what got me in trouble with the newspapers about a year ago, but I still stand by it. The Evangelical Christians believe that they are better than the rest of us in G-d's eyes. They think that they have a special place in "heaven" for themselves at the exclusion of the rest of us. They also believe that if you do not think the way that they think you are going to go to Hell. And that not only pertains to us Jews, but most of you mainstream Christians too! If you do not believe me, just ask them on an evangelical bbs!!
Hmmm. My wife, who is Roman Catholic is embarassed by this mans behaviour and his mis-representation of the Christian faith. Give it some thought and some thorough research, please. - - - So, given that which I have pointed out (and those things are very clearly a GIVEN in cc's religion) how does that make the rest of you Christians out there feel about this mans representation of your religion? Are you going to just let this man "slide"? Or are you going to protest his ignorance and proclaim your own version of Christianity? Or are you all too afraid of this man and also to PC to engage him?
Please let me know how you think about this mans representation of your Christian religious belief system and what good you think that it is doing for the your cause. I am dying to understand this aspect of things.
Stated more succintly - - - where is the "Christian Outrage" pertaining to this mans robbery and distortions of the concepts of a perfectly good religion? Quite frankly, I just do not get it!
It really doesn't bother me nor do I particularly care what Ireland and his group believe. They have a right to believe whatever they want. I am concerned about the adverse impacts of their proposed project. That's the real issue for me and that's what could ultimately affect my quality of life. I believe that debating whose religion is correct is an exercise in futility and counterproductive.
If you think it through, you will conclude that they do not have the right to believe whatever they want. Analyze your statement and you will come to the right conclusion on this - - - I will not get any more specific than that.
Reiterating what Craig said, I am simply amazed that other Christians and Christian leaders are not offended by this mans distortion of their own religion. I suppose that they just feel that it is politically incorrect to question this mans distorted views. That in and of itself is insulting to those who follow the real Christian faith. For example, Marla, Craigs wife is a Christian (Roman Catholic). She is a very moral person and takes her Christianty very seriously. She is highly offended by this man everytime she reads the newspapers and he says something else which is extremely anthithetical to her Christian values. Simply stated, she is offended by ire-lands interpretation of things. You just do not go around bullying people like this man is doing because it is plain and simply not the Christian thing to do. She can not stand the fact that this man claims to be a Christian because his behaviour belies that notion. She can not be the only one in town who feels that way about things, of that I am certain. As for myself, I am nominally Christian, but do not practice it at all. I was raised that way but do not practice yet I do find this mans behaviour offensive nonetheless. He gives Christianity a real bad name, indeed.
Anyone has the right to believe whatever it is they want to believe - it's called FREEDOM OF THOUGHT.
If someone wants to believe that pigs fly or that cows jump over the moon (but only when dishes run away with spoons!) ... then more power to them!
There will only be an issue and a problem when the believer wants ME to also believe the same thing and, as a consequence, ban the eating of pigs and/or cows.
He certainly has the right to believe in anything he wants - and his followers are allowed the same privledge in my book. What is also most certain, is that this egotistical man has subverted my religion (Christinanity) for his own gain (my opinion). It is truly amazing the things he is trying to get over on our town, and shame on his followers for not speaking up against this man.
It is my opinion that this project will never come to fruition at 140 GPR for many varied reasons (so don't sell yet Craig!) what will certainly happen is that this un-pious snake charmer will try and sue the pants off of us...that is if the DEP does not step up and make the correct decision on the complete (???) plans for re-development.
p.s. - I would suggest some serious down time for the Dr rEV. for bible study and deep reflection as to Christian values - it's all in the book rEV....
If you and a group of people believe that it is their right to kill the president of the United States and you express that belief, you will end up in jail for conspiracy even if you do not carry out your belief. Do you need some more examples my friend? I can go on and on about this sujbect if you would like! Aquarius aka Bystander aka Weinstein, you should think before you type.
If you start a church and advocate through your belief system anything violent against our government, all of you will be arrested. You CAN NOT believe in or advocate anything that you choose. Sounds like you may need a basic citizenship lesson.
Now for your english lesson, Bystander / Whinestein. Analogize means to draw an analogy or comparison between one thought or item versus another. In the context that you attempted to use the word, you choose a completely inappropriate word for its context The correct word would have been:
You have been running your mouth off for way too long. You can pretend to be Daniel, you can claim your wife agrees with you, you can claim you have inside info on the Agilent property. When all is said and done you are a big fat NOTHING. You have not been to a planning board meeting in months, you run your mouth on and on with NOTHING to say. YOU have problems with the CC application is way too focused on WHO CC is and WHAT they believe. Why do you feel that YOU have the right questions someones beliefs? It is RATIONAL to question the application, not what the applicant believes in.
Repeating myself: Verbalizing it and/or acting upon it (the belief) is a different topic altogether.
Repeating what you said: If you start a church and advocate through your belief system anything violent against our government all of you will be arrested.
A person can BELIEVE anything they want to believe. A person can not force that belief on anyone else. Free will and Society has checks and balances in place to make sure of that.
It's what is DONE with them (a belief) that causes problems. The problem is not with the belief itself.
My use of the word analogize was correct in the context in which it was intended.
Looks like you have been hitting the absolute again. You need to find more spiritual method to release your tension.
And one more time, I am not CRAIG. I am DANIEL. I am living at 136 Meriden Road here in RT.
Come on over right now and you can sit down and have a nice chit chat with both Craig and Myself.
As for contributions, you have made a grand total of ZIP, Nadda, Null, None! But I understand. Your mind is a bit too feeble to put together a reasoned out argument on anything that you attempt to tackle.
If you are comming over, please ring us up first. We are listed in the phone book.
Looking forward to seeing ya soon, a$$hole. Don't worry, nobody bites here. Craig will probably offer you a beer or whatever you like to drink.
Ok, bystander. Just set up a group and openly advocate the overthrow of the government and see what happens to you.
Now, if you are Christian, I want to hear you say that you are real proud of the way in which ireland has treated this town. Because if this kind of behaviour is typical of the Christian code of ethics, I don't want to have anything to do with the entire lot of you. On the other hand, I think that this ireland character's interpretation of the Bible is disgraceful and I think that more Christians need to come out and express that disgust. Otherwise, if indeed all of you Christians believe that Ireland is treating RT in a charitable and moral fashion, Christianity is pretty much a bankrupt religion.
Come on over and see for yourself. Craig has plenty of adult beverages here which I am certain that you will need. He will not let you go into delerium tremors as he is a very passionate guy. See you soon.
Ah, but there's the thing ... I don't know what's typical or atypical of any (religious) group's code of ethics. Not only am I not a Christian, I am also not a member of any organized religion or religious group.
"Ah, but there's the thing ... I don't know what's typical or atypical of any (religious) group's code of ethics. Not only am I not a Christian, I am also not a member of any organized religion or religious group."
Since you are admitedly not knowledgable about religion, then you should keep your trap shut about anything that involves it. This thread is all about Christianity. Go find a new thread, Weistein. Thankx
The messages I posted in this thread were in regards to the following statement: << .... you will conclude that they do not have the right to believe whatever they want. >> I continue to maintain that a person has the right to believe whatever they want, no matter how arcane that might be ... they do NOT, however, necessarily have the right to act upon the given belief.
<<Since you are admitedly not knowledgable about religion.. >> Whoa! I'm flummoxed at how you came to that conclusion given that all I said was that I do not know what's typical or atypical about a given group's code of ethics. That I'm not a member of any organized religion can't have anything to do with it since it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know how to make a rocket, right? (careful: I'm analogizing again!)
<< This thread is all about Christianity. >> I was not aware that this message thread was limited ONLY to the topic of Christianity. (proof: check the "Topic" line on all my messages in this thread). My bad for having digressed into a more banal chat about freedom of thought.
You really are an ignorant man. I dare you to go out and start a religion or any other sort of group and then sit around a table and discuss the overthrow of the government or some other such similar fascimilee. I wish that you would do that. That has a high probability of putting you in jail which is exactly where you belong.
As it pertains to religious views, a pastor of a church is not ALLOWED to even advocate a particular candidate for public office else they risk loosing their 501(c)3 status.
How do you know that nobody here respects me? Are you clairvoyant or just drunk again? Yes, I am a bigot - - - I hate idiots like yourself who like to make noise but have absolutely nothing useful to add to the conversation. You my friend are the town fool. Go buy another bottle of absolute and enjoy some more self indulgance.
btw and fyi, do you know why nj.con has cooled it down a bit over there: Answer: Because my landlord, Craig gave me the number so that I could call the Anti Defamation League. They are monitoring the situation over there and have been in touch with the Ledger about it.
Now, who accomplished that feat a$$hole? Duh - - - it was me, myself and I! You just keep making noise like a 2 year old instead of doing something constructive - - - probably because you do not the ability to do anything useful : cry:.
One more thing which is pertinent to this thread, RT. If you are a Christian, you consider your behaviour on this bbs to be a real shining example of Christian virtue? Is cursing out a stranger within the purview of well intended Christianity? Or are you one of those Christians who figures that you have the license to say or do anything that you like because at the end of the day (or lifetime) you will receive redemption unlike non-Christians? U better go do a little soul searching my friend, and keep off the sauce.
In the interest of living up to my so called reputation, I am responding to you. I have no plans of shutting up, so get used to it buddy or learn how to type only when you have something useful to say. BTW - is calling a stranger an ASSWIPE part of the Christian doctrine? It is interesting that you have called me that name and a bunch of other names under the basic thread called "Is This Christianity?" I have done a lot of useful things here. List below exactly what you have done:
Oh, I see, you have done so much that you can not even remember what you have done. Typical.
Lol...AS$WIPE...I love that word. Yes, By your ponderous nonsensical blustings, and your horrible treatment of some people's take on religion; I proudly proclaim you KING OF ALL AS$WIPES. TA DAH!!
So, you assume because I think your a bigot, I'm Christrian. You're really not as smart as people think you are, Craig. I am not but nor am I religious. Not in the slightest. I haven't stepped foot in a Church, Synagogue. Mosque, or Shrine in years.
But I can still tell when someone is an AS$WIPE.
Stop AS$uming, stop putting people down because they think a different way than you, go to PB meeting before you critique them. And maybe you will be dethroned as THE KING OF ALL AS$WIPES. TA DAH!!!!
Craig, bottom line, people can believe what they want, and the nice thing about living in a free society is you can ignore them or speak out against them. However, there is no moral or practical way to stop them. So ignore them and move on. Personally, I could give a rat's @ss what other people think, do or say. As long as they are not hurting anyone in the process.
The issue we are faced with is the affect on our quality of life and our environment, that 5000-20,000 people and associated infrastructure will bring to 140 GPR. It doesnt matter if they are Fundamentalist Christian's, Amish, Shiat Muslim's, Hasidic Jews, or any other extremist religious groups.
All you have show with your comments is that, since you are a Christian, you are just as intolerant of other religions as Ireland is. If you consider yourself Christian, I would have to assume that all other Christians are totally embarassed by your behaviour on this board.
The only thing that I am intolerant of is religious intolerance. Christ Church is religiously intolerant, just as you are. It is your way or no way and that is intolerant. And, if you get into trouble, you just ask for forgiveness and all is well with the world. Well, it just does work that way my good friend.
I think that we now know who the asswipe is. Look in the mirror, buddy.
Daniel
ps - I noticed the complete lack of a listing of contributions made by yourself to this discussion. If you look back on mine, you will find them too numerous to count. And also, most of my prognostications thus far have come to pass. So, maybe it is time you started listening to what I have to say instead of blathering all over your bib cloth.
Contributions?? What, to your hurtful crap of a message string? I have contributed by: studying the facts down at the municipal bldg, attended the PB meetings, attended VORT meetings, studied RLUIPA cases, contacted Sierra Club, contacted VORT members, attempted to contact CC, added useful info on this site from other sources. I have NEVER given a damn what the people of CC believe in. It has absolutley nothing to do with my concerns regarding 140 Green Pond. You on the other hand seem to be obsessed by it.
WHAT HAVE YOU DONE, CRAIG? Insulted an entire group of our town (Christians). Made Rockaway look like you; intolerant ignorant angry trolls.
Plus you had NOTHING to do with quieting down NJ.CON. The ADL has not lifted a finger regarding that board. I'm sure they are monitoring it, but that's it.
Plus AS$WIPE...I'm not Christian.
Once again. STFU. At least go to the PB meetings before you offer an opinion. And release a letter of apology to our Christian residents.
You have done nothing! If you had any brains you would realize that my prognistications about things like the following came true:
1. I predicted that Megachurches are the same in the eyes of the law as churches and Gigachurches.
2. I predicted that the Highlands bill would do nothing for us
3. I predicted that Ireland would get an exemption
4. I predict (in the future) that our request for review will be either turned down or the case will be thrown back to the DEP after which they will decide that their original thinking regarding the exemption was correct.
5. I predicted that this man is building for 20,000 and not 5000.
6 I discoverd his community development corporation which other people were not aware of.
7. I discovered that Ireland has purchased another 10 acres of land in town.
And I can go on and on.
As for you - - - I guess that your Santa Claus on a Crucifix was about as sophisticated as you will ever get. That was pretty disgusting and blatently anti Christian.