I hope everyone takes a few minutes out this weekend and talks to their neighbors and friends about coming to the meeting on Monday night. It appears that some think the PB has already made up their mind to approve the project. I think we really need to make a showing on Monday in case there are any members that are sitting on the fence. Hopefully they will see the light. Personally I cant believe that any member of the PB can honestly accept this project. As I just told Jennings on the phone, it isnt a matter of balancing the Pros vs. the Cons. There hasnt been a single Pro put forth during the last 3 Yrs of hearings. There are only Cons (in more ways then one). Only problems, potential problems, and what CC themselves are calling "manageable problems". The PB has bent over backwards to give them a fair hearing, now they should do whats right for RT and flatly REJECT the project. It holds no benefit for RT. NONE, NADA.
I want the board members to realize that if they ever had any political aspirations, they can kiss them good-bye should they vote in favor of this disaster. We are all watching very closely and will not take kindly to the approval of this megabusiness.
Of a lawsuit, and even fear of the effort required to defend their position if that happens. Fear of being portrayed badly in the press, of looking like a bad guy.
There are people out there who would do the wrong thing, simply because it's the easiest.
Let's hope our planning board members have the fortitude to stand up for what's right for our township--which is why the planning board exists to begin with.
They have to know they have the support of just about the whole township.
Everyone on the PB is indemnified against personal loss by an insurance policy provided by RT. That is standard practice. There is really very little rational reason for these folks to "fear" ireland or cc.
If they act from a position of fear, they are not serving the public good and should be kicked off of the planning board. There is no room for the faint of heart operating in that kind of arena considering the tremendously high IMPACT that their decison will have on 24,000 people living in RT.
If they vote incorrectly, we should show them the door. We should also show Dimin the exit sign too. (Actually, we should have done that a long time ago.)
In summary, "fear" is an unacceptable excuse should anyone on the PB not vote in the best interest of the good citizens of RT; after all, they vow to act in the best interest of the township, not in the best interest of a megadeveloper.
Hopefully the PB members that represent sections of RT that are further away from ground zero will also realize that we're all in this together. I suspect that those of us that would have to plow through the megachurch traffic on a daily basis would see a reduction in the values of our homes. In that event, I would like to explore how to get our assessed valuations and property taxes adjusted accordingly. I believe that would only be fair even though it would shift a greater portion of the tax burden to other sections of RT. Perhaps we could share any necessary fees for legal assistance, real estate appraisers, etc. Just a thought. Hopefully it won't come to that.
Property values have already taken a huge hit in this area. We know that first hand having been unable to sell our home over a 1 year period - - - no offers. Homes located in the Meriden corridor are almost unsellable. Clearly, we plan to protest our property taxes should this thing go through. Meriden, Farber Hill, and vicinity will become a highly distressed area. To a slightly lesser degree, so will the rest of RT.
Everyone seems to miss a key statistic:
Irelands Folly will be around 70 % the size of the Continental Arena which holds 19,000 people for Hockey games and even more for rock concerts.
Forget what ireland says his membership is. Think about that statistic, PB members and ask yourselves,
"What the hell is this man really up to and at whose expense?"
I will not comment too much on a message board, for obvious reasons, but there are some reasons to 'approve' with conditions, obviously there are reasons to deny and there are reasons to abstain. If they are not able to come to a majority then it will head to court for a judge to make the call. There is a good chance that this will be a 3 way split. I will say that regardless of the vote Voices of Rockaway Twp has accomplished several of its goals and this project is far smaller then the original plans. I remain very proud of my neighbors who came out meeting after meeting to have their voice heard. I am sure that this is not over yet as we have not heard from the DEP and regardless of the vote on Monday nothing matters until the DEP rules.
I hope to see you all tomorrow at the community center for the event for Carla's kids and on Monday night at the planning board meeting.
Lisa
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The truth wins out over slick PR and personal attacks.
The Christ Church Plan for the redevelopment of 140 Green Pond Rd is just too big for the area.
I dont know about everyone else, but in my book, any abstention is tantamount to an approval. Thats just a clear shirking of ones duty so I hope they dont think that will get them off the hook. Approval with conditions also doesnt fly with me, because the town will never enforce conditions nor will they constantly be there to monitor. Once he's in, he's in. Then you really dont have a leg to stand on with regards to RLUIPA. As for the DEP...I wonder if they arent just bidding their time waiting to see which way the vote goes and they can just go along for the ride without having to make any hard decisions either.
I think that it is pretty clear that this thing is going to be approved. And no, Lisa, you have not accomplished a thing but for the spinning of your wheels. The objective was to keep this monstrosity out of here. Lisa, please reconsider your by-line which goes like this:
"The truth wins out over slick PR and personal attacks." It is childish and immature.
And -
There is no such thing as almost winning the lottery. If this thing is approved, you may as well rename the town "New Ireland". It will become infamous as the home of the largest megacircus on the east coast of the US.
BTW - approval is the outcome that I have been predicting for three years now. There is but one alternative as I have been saying all along:
I agree. It's difficult to comprehend that anything other than a vote to deny the application is anything but tantamount to selling the section of RT that the megachurch would directly impact down the river. How is the town or anyone else going to control this thing once it gets its foot in the door? I guess the only thing that we can do is to see that our loss of property value is reflected in a reduced tax bill. Not a wonderful consolation for the mess this thing will make of our section of the town but it may be all we can do. This definitely stinks.
Our problem may be like yours; our life savings are pretty much tied up in this place and it will become of very little value in the marketplace. What do we do when we want to retire and purchase our final home? Maybe we should ask ireland for some charity, right?
At least if we had a mortgage on the place, we would simply consider defaulting on it and let the bank deal with the situation. But we do not.
My problem is that I live north of 140 GPR and depend on green pond road to access route 80 and just about everyplace that I need to go. During rush hour now the traffic is pretty bad at the route 80 interchange. This will make it a real mess and the town will not be able to effectively control future growth. I guess it's all been said before but this definitely isn't what we thought we were buying into.
I hope that any of the PB members considering abstention heeds Chuck. It will be viewed as an "approval" by the citizens of the township. And an approval with conditions is just what Chuck said. It will give ireland free reign to do whatever the hell he wants to do at 140; that is crystal clear to most all of us but for the Planning Board itself.
Anyone here think that Dicker and Dimmin should keep their jobs? I do not. They represent the pinacle of incompetence and do not represent the best interest of this township. Fire 'em both.
Rat said: "Anyone here think that Dicker and Dimmin should keep their jobs? I do not. They represent the pinacle of incompetence and do not represent the best interest of this township. Fire 'em both."
If it passes, and I pray it doesn't, (Yes David we pray too), then I agree, out they go. One would hope their cavalier attitude over the past 3 years was just a front to look unbiased.
Furthermore, any board member who abstains is ineffective and should follow their vote with resignation from the PB. Any member who approves…… well…. just ask Doty what it feels like to be an outsider in your own town……
Planning Board. Have some balls. This is OUR town. Only one way to vote: DENIED. Don't be intimidated by a big business hiding behind religion. Bring on Marci and the court case. Once the damage is done, it’s too late. We will be stuck with this 3 ring circus for a long time. Send those wolves in sheep’s clothing packing!
I would expect that one very realistic option is to see an approval with conditions, one of the conditions will obviously be the securing of a DEP exemption to the Highlands which the applicant does not currently have. There are many many other conditions that can be placed on the project, including no underground parking.
I am rather sure that there will be a few who abstain, I am not saying I think they are right or wrong in doing so but that they are going to do it. I also think there are some that will vote to deny the application. Majority rules and it is going to be very intersting to see how this plays out.
I will be interested to see how many people acutally get involved and volunteer their time in the future to sit on town boards, get out to meeting and participate in open public meetings. Those who actually get involved can make a positive difference, those who sit back and play Monday morning quaterback are just spinning their wheels.
If we have learned anything thus far it is that people do care and will get involved if asked to do so. One other thing - this is not the end of this matter simply the end of a chapter, the book has many chapters to go before we close the book.
See you tonight. Lisa
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The truth wins out over slick PR and personal attacks.
The Christ Church Plan for the redevelopment of 140 Green Pond Rd is just too big for the area.
If some are going to abstain, what the hell are they doing wasting a chair on our planning board?
As per someone else's comment, those abstainers should turn in their resignation immediately along with their lack of position taken on this most important matter.
On further thought, I wish that those would be abstainers would do us all a great big favor and just get sick tonight. Stay at home, please.
It is impossible to fathom someone approving an indoor arena project on Green Pond Road that is almost the size of Contintental Arena!. Think about it and it is absolutely astounding.
